Post Chelski-Juventus Thoughts

By: agiamba | February 26th, 2009

A disappointing result, but not necessarily a disappointing display. Other than the opening minutes where we looked extremely nervous, Juventus was not bullied around last night at Stamford Bridge, the team held its´own. To be honest, I thought we´d at least draw in London. The last 24 hours or so have not felt right, I´ve just felt unsettled the entire time. The downside of being a tifoso, I suppose. This 1-0 loss is tough.

Brief thoughts and news-

-Molinaro is regretful we didn´t score but urges the team to think about Napoli this weekend.
-Camoranesi is out for several weeks, with a fractured rib from the Chelsea match as well as what else, a thigh strain.
-U2 visited the Juventus dressing room…Del Piero believes Juve can still make it through.
-Ranieri believes Juve will have to be perfect for the return leg, and laments conceding the early goal.
-Buffon echoes Ranieri in his disappointment that with a good performance, we still got a poor result.
-Inter fans, classless as always, hurled insults at Platini, calling him a Juventino di merda, for his choice of referee. Best part? This was the VIP section, where the ´gentlemen´sit. I guess one of the few Spanish referees allowed to ref el Clasico as well as being the 4th official for the 2006 World Cup Final means he´s not competent enough.

Still a world-class douche!

Progress: We played decently. Considering we were up against a Russian billionaire who financed the team to a CL final and 2 consecutive semfinals, we played own game. Trez, Nedved, Del Piero, and Marchionni all had good chances to score. As I said in the last post:

Some of us realize that Rome wasn´t built in a day, and as Edgar Davids said, we need to have patience. Two years ago Chelsea was playing Liverpool in the semifinals of the CL, with Mourinho as coach and all the money in the world. We were playing in Arezzo with players like Giannichedda, Boumsong, and Bojinov. I´m damn proud of what we´ve accomplished thus far.

Camoranesi: Are we witnessing the end of Camoranesi? I thought he had a miserable game last night, and yes, I´m aware he´s coming back from injury. Against Palermo he looked more exhausted than Nedved in the 2nd half, before being hauled off. Camo, who has been one of my favorite players, has been plagued with 3-month injuries the last two years. Today´s news that he will be out for about a month doesn´t give me much confidence. Given that he´s 32, we might need to start thinking of an alternative. Marchionni played very well last night, but he´s been quite inconsistent this season. (at least he´s seemingly shrugged off his injury problems)

Nedved: Speaking of aging wingers, Nedved has sadly confirmed what we all feared; he will retire at the end of this season. One of the greatest players of recent Juventus history, no doubt, it´ll be very odd to see a Juventus game without him. La Furia Ceca has said while he is still enjoying playing, it is time for him to spend time with his family and leave his role to the younger players. What disappoints me about this most is he can keep playing…just not 180 minutes every week. Ranieri, who everyone likes to call Tinkerman, has not been tinkering enough! If he did, Nedved could easily play 2 more seasons. He´s been excellent when rested this season, but for whatever reason Ranieri doesn´t want to play without him.

Offside Trap: Can we stop playing it, please? Not only does it give us tifosi heart attacks, we´ve been conceding too much from it recently. If the defense can´t cope with it, whether due to rotation or just plain shittiness, don´t play it!

The Champion´s League dream isn´t over yet. There´s still the return leg in Turin.

FORZA JUVE!

Some Related Juventus Posts:

Category: Team News

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Ravi

Armando, I gotta say, that's a damn good idea
Armando

Does anyone agree with me that i think we shouldve used a 3-3-1-3 formation in the last 15-20 minutes against Chelsea? Yes i know it's an awkward formation, but i think it wouldve worked. Leave it with Mellberg, Legro, and Chiellini fortifying the back, and without any wingbacks running up the flanks so much, we might have an even stronger defense with all 3 staying back instead of just 2 staying back most of the time like we have with the 4-man defense. Then have Marchionni (Camo got hurt), Sissoko, and Marchisio in the middle, with Marchionni and Marchisio helping to supply the forwards and Sissoko staying back to cover the defense. And then have Del Piero in his natural trequartista position, with Trezeguet, Iaquinta, AND Amauri all up front together, in frankly a scary forward line. So it wouldve been like this:

Buffon
Mellberg Chiellini Legrottaglie
Marchionni(or Salihamidzic) Sissoko Marchisio(or Nedved)
Del Piero
Amauri Trezeguet Iaquinta

Look at it, stronger defense, basically the same midfield, and stronger offense. The only problem would be that it wouldve given them alot of space on the flanks, but i think the defenders and midfielders would still be able to cover that when needed. I think it wouldve worked to be honest, and we probably couldve came away with a draw, including that ever-so-crucial away goal, and then we'd be going into the second leg with the advantage instead of them. What do you guys think? I know it's obviously not the best formation, or even a good one, but it is good for the last 20 or so minutes of a game when we desperately need a goal.
agiamba

I don't agree. We have some quality backups, up top, Iaquinta/Amauri, Marchionni, De Ceglie, Brazzo, Giovinco on the wings, in center-mid Zanetti, Tiago, Poulsen, and in defense Mellberg.

It amazes me though that our defenders have all remained healthy for so long...the fact that Zebina/Andrade/Knezevic have been out all season hasn't been noticed.
adam

True and I'm glad we didn't, but quality can't end at the starting eleven if your aiming to win something. No matter how much depth you have, a concept we seem to have forgotten.
Armando

True, but he's incredible now. One of the most dangerous in the air i've ever seen.

And Camo on-form is ridiculously good. It wouldve been a huge mistake to sell him during the scandal.
adam

Yea but he was shit back then Armando.
adam

Joaquin for Camo next season. There's a huge difference in quality when we play with an onform Camoranesi. He's been out most of this season and most of last season, we should atleast get a quality back up.

Come to think of it, right before the scandal Moggi was gonna sell Camoranesi to some Spanish team and bring Joaquin to Turin.
Armando

And on the ex-Juve/Napoli eleven, i might even put Amauri on the list to be honest. Remember, he played for Napoli back in the day.
Armando

Camo just took a hard tackle and landed totally wrong and ended up breaking a rib. I dont think he's soft, he just had bad luck.

And i agree with Marco about the traitors. The only real traitor is Ibrahimovic, leaving us when we were relegated to Serie B because of the scandal. Though i think while Roberto Baggio didnt play quite as good after he left Juve, he still played very well, at least when the Inter and Milan coaches gave him a chance, which they rarely did.
adam

I'm reading that Secco wants Nedved to play on a few more seasons. I hope this is not true, he's been a great player and should be remembered that way. The way he's played this season makes him go out in an embarrassing fashion for a player of his caliber.

It was time to move on last season and time for change, especially at such an important position. It's sad to see him in games when he can barely chase the ball.
Marco P.

The only real "traitor" in that list, as far as Juve are concerned, is Ibrahimovic. None of the other players played even remotely as good after they left as they did with us.

And since we're linking articles, for those speaking Italian Gazzetta has a great Juve-Napoli preview in the form of an ex-Bianconeri/Napoletani starting eleven. Their verdict?

Zoff
Ferrara, F.Cannavaro, Burgnich, Luppi
Mauro, Vojak, Pecchia
Fonseca, Altafini, Sivori
Coach: Lippi (who else?)

An interesting read...
KJ

Camo, tough luck or soft as Totti?
agiamba

http://www.channel4.com/sport/...

5 of this lists top 10 betrayed the Bianconeri! What the hell.
agiamba

Jack, by that comment I meant Chelsea 2-1 Juventus. But way to draw assumptions.

Armando, by the Camo comment I didn't mean he's losing his talent. His performance against Chelsea is totally forgiveable, considering his condition. My point was he's been injured more than he hasn't, and then we have to wait for a few weeks for him to get into good form. Given his age, I'm not sure how long he can keep it up.
Sam

juve napoli!
Sam

I really hope we can pull sumthin out! we need this will ill be jubilent! mnever the less im still very happy!
Tom

hye any of u guys get the 9.3.0 patch Football Manager? if so have any changes been made to juve team?
Justin

Offside traps require a lot of cooperation from the defense. It was nervewracking for me to watch the team use that play while Mellberg and Chiellini (I think) arguing over something. Maybe I'm wrong but really, we should drop it. Juve has strong enough defenders who can go mano-a-mano with strikers.

Can I echo that anti-Tiago sentiment? He had a couple of good passes but he shouldn't be giving balls away that easily! He's not a Sissoko where he gives the ball, but takes it away.

THERE really is hope. I quite remember Juve not losing at home in the Champion's League? Not really dwelling on this fact but thinking positively, the least could happen (hope not, though) is a 1-1. I think it's likely that 1-0 result with penalties to determine the winner.

I'm psyched for next week!
Tom

The thingo is you play an offside trap when u know u have a quick defense like rio ferdinand and pepe, not leggro and chilinni! The have average pace but not enough for a offisde trap to be put in!
Faisal

We were very unlucky not to tie up the match, we definitely deserved to draw. What I saw in the game was Nedved not being able to put some power behind his shots, which was surprising for one of them where he wasn't under much pressure from the chelski defense.
The whole offside trap is getting old, especially when we're up against players like drogba who specialize in breaking offside traps.
As for the line up, I agree it should be a 4-3-1-2 (that's my pro evo 2009 line up)
This is especially true since we saw that Amauri and Trez have the ability to play together, and with del piero right behind them, and marchionni and giovinco behind him, we have the ability to do a great short passing game or feed our forwards long balls.

Well, we still have the away match ahead of us, and I really expect chelski to play more offensively, so assuming buffon and the backline can keep a clean sheet, we can definitely go through within 90 minutes.
Ravi

Jack's a wanker
Armando

Yes, you were very clear, thanks alot, i appreciate it.

And a 4-3-1-2 doesnt stop Camo and Nedved from running on the flanks like people make it seem. It just gives them a broader range to cover, but still much better. It puts Del Piero in his natural trequartista position, Marchisio is better than either Sissoko or Tiago, especially offensively (he's probably not as good as Sissoko defensively, but if Molinaro and Grygera stay back just a little bit more, it'll be fine), and Amauri and Trezeguet is a big, DANGEROUS front attacking line, who work together great.

It would be like this:

===============Buffon===============
Grygera==Legro===Chiellini==Molinaro
Marchionni=====Marchisio======Nedved
==============Del Piero=============
=======Trezeguet=======Amauri=======

ON THE BENCH: Manninger, Mellberg, Ariaudo, Salihamidzic, Sissoko, Tiago, Poulsen, Giovinco, and Iaquinta.

--Camoranesi and De Ceglie will most likely be injured for the 2nd leg so wont be available, but i would start them both if they were available. By the way, Grygera/Mellberg and Nedved/Giovinco are pretty much interchangeable in my opinion for starters, i put it that way because that's the way it usually is, but it doesnt matter.
Jack

"What are Chelsea fans looking to get out of tomorrow? I’d be happy with 2-1, or something as long as we get an away goal or two."

Had to wait until after the match to address this, but hilarious comment. You seriously thought you were going to come to the Bridge at net two?

P.S. love the tired reference to our spending, especially considering you support Juventus.
Anon

If juve level the scores by scoring one in turin, then it goes into extra time. But if chelsea score and juve level by scoring two it CANNOT go into extra time as chelsea would have won because of the fact that they scored an away goal. So if chelsea score in turin then the match cannot go into extra time as you cannot cancel out their away goal. So to your question if juve score two and chelsea score one, juve will lose. And yes, if chelsea do not score juve need to score one to go into extra time and 2 to win.

As for sporting no, since they are playing in munich all they have to do is score 5. Which will cancel out bayerns five in portugal and bring the tie into extra time. For them to win it in normal time they need to score 6 clear goals without reply.

I hope i was clear as its getting quite late in england, so excuse the grammatical errors >.>;
Ravi

Molinaro really needs to go. I like the lad but he played terribly on Wed night. Though I admit the whole defensive line looked pretty shaky..
Ravi

It's true that Sporting have almost zero chance but similar deficits have been overcome before. What was it, 4 or 5 years ago when Milan overturned a 4-1 loss against Deportivo to win 4-0 at the San Siro?? Still losing 0-5 at home is horribly embarrassing. Is Sporting going through an injury crisis or do they just not belong in the knockout rounds?

I'm thinking a 4-3-1-2 is the answer but since Chelsea attacks down the wings won't such a formation leave us horribly exposed? That is unless we play a high defensive line like we've successfully played against the Milanese teams this term. But then again those teams don't possess the same pace as Chelsea..
Armando

To Anon-

So if Chelsea score one, then Juve need to score 3 to win? So it counts for double basically? what if Juve score 2, it goes to extra time and then spot kicks if it has to? And if Chelsea dont score, then Juve need to score what? 1 to go to extra time, 2 to win?

So basically, Sporting has absolutely no chance, unless then can pull a 10-0 win over Bayern out of their asses, correct?
roberto

Totally unbelievable what happened to Camoranesi this season. I'm still in a state of shock about his new found injuries. He's got to be beyond frustrated at this point. Come to think about it, so am I. Unreal, fucking unreal.

PAVEL I LOVE YOU, I'LL MISS YOU.
Anon

An away goal means that the team which scored an away goal when the scores are tied on aggregate, that team will go through. But its only works in a tie, so say a team is winning 2-1 on aggregate, and the team with the 1 goal has an away goal they will not go through. It is said to count for double, e.g. If chelsea score 1 at turin then juventus have to score three. 2 to level the scores and 1 to win. Wiki i think can make it more clearer: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A...

Btw, im and arsenal fan and i wanted to say kudos on the game. You might not have won but at least you played very well some people were actually a tad disappointed a the fact that some of the italian teams werent that good after being tipped for huge things (not looking at you, inter >.>). But anyway, kudos.
Armando

And by the way, i'm still relatively new to football/soccer compared to some of you, so can someone explain what the big deal is about the away goals in the Champions League? What happens if Chelsea score one in Turin? Can we still win, or what?
Armando

I dont think Camoranesi is losing it at all. This is only his third game back from injury remember, and remember that in the first game, his very first cross from being back resulted in a goal from a Iaquinta header. He just hasnt regained his awesome form quite yet, and now he's injured again unfortunately. But on a good day, he's still one of the best wingers in the world, and the best italian midfielder in the world in my opinion.

I dont think we should play Tiago. I think he had his time to shine years ago at Chelsea, but since moving to Juve he's just not the same.

Sissoko is a great defensive midfielder, but he needs to stick to short passes, and not try to run up so much. Also, he looked totally overwhelmed today by the Chelsea attacking midfield, probably because he didnt really get much, if any help from Tiago.

Marchisio is the way to go in Central midfield in my opinion. Great shot, incredible control, and decent defensively. Though i think Ranieri started Tiago in front of Marchisio today because Tiago has more experience in Champions League matches, plus he would be good to use against his old team. That WOULD be a great strategy...if Tiago hadnt lost most of his form since his Chelsea days. Even still, i think Marchisio would be the best choice alongside Sissoko if we're using the 4-4-2 formation Ranieri insists on using.

Another problem is, our wing-backs dont stay back enough, especially Molinaro, he probably spends almost as much if not more time in the attacking part of the pitch than the defensive part. Though Molinaro has greatly improved recently, he still makes that mistake a bit too often.

Though, one thing i liked was Mellberg starting. He's very a big, strong defender, who may not be as good as Grygera offensively, but can provide a wicked header from set pieces, and is much better defensively in my opinion. So really, it's all opinion for that right wing-back position, Grygera if you want more attacking, Mellberg if you want more defending.

Now, we used a 4-4-2 like this against Chelsea...

Buffon
Mellberg Legrottaglie Chiellini Molinaro
Camoranesi Sissoko Tiago Nedved
Amauri Del Piero

...when we shouldnt have. We NEED to use a 4-3-1-2, and sacrifice a midfielder for another attacker, and move ADP back a bit into his natural trequartista position. I was so happy when Trezeguet came on for Sissoko, after Tiago already came off for Marchisio. All we would need after that would be a healthy Camo to still be on, and move ADP back instead of using the 4-3-3 like Ranieri did, and we wouldve had the perfect formation! This is the formation i want:

Buffon
Mellberg(or Grygera) Legrottaglie Chiellini Molinaro
Marchionni(Camo or probably even Salihamidzic once they get back though) Marchisio(or Sissoko) Nedved(or Giovinco)
Del Piero
Trezeguet Amauri

(We played basically like this late in the game, but with Del Piero up front with Amauri and Trez which was a mistake. He shouldve moved back a bit).

And lastly, was i the only one to notice that seemingly every time Del Piero got the ball, the Chelsea defenders or whoever was marking him fouled him after failing to get the ball from him? I remember one time especially when Alex was dribbling and outmaneuvered two Chelsea players so they fouled him (i believe from behind).
agiamba

Deschamps or Gasperini would be awesome, but I don't see Gian Piero leaving Genoa now. Far too early for Ferrara or Conte.

I expect to see Ranieri fulfill his contract, finish out in 2010, and then pick a new relatively young Italian manager.
alex

because you need a better manager! and my god get diego hes quality just watched the werder milan match. and you didnt get motta because secco is an idiot and you have him for 2 more seasons at least
adam

Why did we not get Motta? Roma are gonna pay peanuts for him.

And if we do get Diego don't expect us to be a bigger threat, we might even be worse. It's been two years and we still haven't found our personal style while playing with the same 4-4-2. Next season we will switch to a 4-3-1-2 how long will it take us to get used to that?
agiamba

All the Brits in the Pub I was at were very impressed with Juventus, whether they were Liverpool or Chelski fans. Of the 3 Italian teams, we were the only team to really give the other team a real run for their money, and that was at Stamford Bridge. And that we were in the provincial fields a few years ago, well, we have risen meteorically.
ricci

not a juve fan, but I got to agree with Marco on the Tiago point. I cringed when I saw his name in the lineup yesterday. Marchisio has really proved himself as a quality all around player and definitely offers more than Tiago.

Molinaro doesn't have a lot of quality about him but his pace doesn't drop the entire game. By the 80th minute he's still going as fast as he was in the 1st minute.

Hopefully Ranieri doesn't make the same mistakes next time around, because I think Juve has the quality to pull it out.
Marco P.

We're definitely not dead & buried. The fear of conceding a goal at the Olimpico is a huge weight on our shoulders, but everything is still left to play for in this match.

Camoranesi? Bad luck, that's all it is. Age might indeed be catching up, but on a good healthy day Camo's still got the pace of a youngster.

Nedved? Wouldn't exclude a drastic reconsideration on his retirement plans. Of course everything is tied to Juve's progress in Europe, and how exactly it will affect the Czech legend's psyche. If we go out, will he play for one more season in order to finally win that bloody cup eluding him? If we do win the UCL, will he call it quits in full glory? Personally I'd settle for the latter any day.

Added word on Tiago: nervous & hasty. Two good passes to ADP and not a whole lot more. Marchisio, when he came on, gave us the kind of disciplined performance (especially passing-wise) tied with the unpredictable (and I mean that in a positive way) "OMG moment" (cf the blast just a few yards wide of the target). My guess is that he's earned a starter spot for the return leg, but we'll see.
ben

Yes, I am damn pround of this team as well. This is a remarkable comeback from Juventus, almost unseen in history: at least not from when I seriously started watching football. Juventus was a force in London. Not many teams can play with possession in London and we did it. Within the next 2-3 years, we will rock Europe. I am still not losing hope for the 2nd leg. I pray for a good reaction from Juventus and little luck on our side.
alex

lightning sorry
alex

and juventus is what got me into italian football im not a die hard fan but i watch them alot and have done for 12 years and they won a shitload so i get annoyed when players like molinaro get a game