A win, thanks to the PEZZO GROSSO

By: agiamba | November 22nd, 2009

First thought of the game: With two Bianconeri sides, why is no one wearing black-and-white? Tonight was a game far from vintage stuff, but it’s 3 points against a spirited opponent and some interesting observations. Ratings and review after the jump.

Le Pagelle:

Buffon: 6- Had little to do all night, until a great stop on Floro Flores. As I’ve said in the past, that’s the mark of a great keeper, being attentive for 90minutes when little is coming your way.
Caceres: 6.5- A very good performance from the young Uruguayan, who surely must get an extended run out at right-back! Grygera is a decent reserve option, but we know we’ve seen his peak, more or less. Caceres has shown plenty of potential and he’s still young and in his first few months in Serie A. Strong in the tackle, fast, and plenty willing to help out up front. Excellent volley for Grosso’s goal.
Cannavaro: 5.5- Generally assured at the back, but he did have some nervy moments, ie- when he let the ball pass by him, unaware that Caceres/some Udinese player were coming at the far post, or when he thought Floro Flores wasn’t near him after a poor Udinese through ball.
Chiellini:7- Yet again, an absolute beast in defense and had a good opportunity or two up front. My favorite part of todays performance was when he confronted Romero about diving. Little bitch.
Grosso: 7- Another good performance. Who ever thought we’d have a game where our two fullbacks played excellently?!? Confident in defense, and as always, willing to help up front. An extra .5 for his goal, that he started the move for, and decided to go into the box, and it payed off. I’d still like to see De Ceglie get some playing time, but Molinaro should move on if he doesn’t want to be a reserve.

Poulsen: 7- A great game from Poulsen, in fact, he gets the Alessio’s Man-of-the-Match award. Shielded well in defense, fought for every ball, won several back and actually had some terrific passes, such as the chip to Caceres for Grosso’s goal, and a wonderful throughball that Amauri should have had but was outrun by Zapata. Who knows, maybe he’s getting back to his Sevilla days?
Melo: 5- Unlike his center-midfield partner Poulsen, who excelled, Felipe Melo gets Alessio’s Flop-of-the-Match. He didn’t break up like normally, he didn’t recover balls, and his passing was atrocious. Maybe he’s paying for the fatigue of playing for Brazil internationally and then straight against Udinese, I don’t know. All I have to say is this: Poulsen playing as our best midfielder over Melo and our fullbacks playing brilliantly? Is this the twilight zone??
Sissoko: 7- As Datasport said, his return was an “important recovery for Juventus.” Absolutely beastly in midfield, winning balls back and chasing down opponents, this was vintage Momo. Let’s hope he can keep the injuries at bay, and remember two words: simple passes.

Camoranesi: 6- Unlike the rest of our team, he played better in the first half. Our best player in the winger position, with some good runs and decent passes. Something wasn’t clicking with the winger-trident though.
Diego: 6- Some decent plays, but it just wasn’t really happening for him today. Several of his passes were just off by a few feet. The deference he payed to ADP in letting him take free kicks was very good to see.
Giovinco: 5.5- Udinese was playing hardball, and apparently the pitch at the Olimpico was very, very wet. Gio, and most of the winger trident was slipping a lot, and generally misplacing their passes.
Del Piero: 5.5- A disappointing display, for me. A few times he tried to dribble too much, and he had really very little impact on the game.
De Ceglie: s.v- Not enough time to impact the game, though he did have one great cross.

Amauri: 5.5- Blech. As I said after his game-winning goal against Siena, ” Ironic now he’s scoring despite looking totally static up front.” Except today he wasn’t scoring. He needs to learn how to play as a lone striker, because there were several times where there was some nice passing going on in the winger-trident, and he was just kind of standing at the edge of the box. I kept thinking “Move, it, damnit!” Seriously, you’ve gotta give someone a target for a throughball pass or something. Really shoulda scored on his chance against Handanovic.

Here is where WordPress decided to eat the rest of my posting, so I’m going to post the other random thoughts I had, abbreviated.

ADP v. Diego- Today showed there is going to be a conflict. ADP, Diego, and the 4-2-3-1 cannot be on the pitch at the same time.
D’Agostino- Good set piece delivery…the way he whipped his crosses and passes in was impressive, even if the rest of the game wasn’t.

Lastly, on the same day that Wigan was crushed 9-1 and ManU breezed by Everton 3-0, newly-promoted Parma beat Fiorentina at home 3-2, as well as Livorno defeated Genoa. Milan conceded 3 to an energetic Cagliari, and Juve triumphed at home 1-0 against a very spirited Udinese side. The EPL bills itself as “the most exciting league in the world.” If you want lots of goals (poor defense) and predictable results, then yes, it’s the perfect league. I can see it as a very “digestible” league to new fans, like those in China and America that the league so desperately ~~whores itself out to~~ aggressively markets to. But me? I’ll take the best tacticians, the craziness of Zampa, the Lazio dissidents, the drama of newly promoted Parma and Bari travelling to Florence and the San Siro and getting a result, and the topsy turvy Serie A table. In short…give me il campionato piu bello.

Some Related Juventus Posts:

Category: Team News

« Preview: Juventus v. Udinese | Home | CL Preview: ‘Yea, I’m Sad He’s Not Playing Too’ »

alex

barcelona are doing well with yaya toure, keita and their equivalent of marchisio in busquets so i cant see why you cant accommodate everyone.
j

and a win against blanc, we need to focus on scudetto...
j

i think there are only 2 midfielders on probation, tiago and poulsen, for defence or specifically full backs, zebina and molinaro. these 4 players have till the end of the season to prove themselves or we could shipped them out asap in june/july.

melo and amauri should be given more time. they are overpriced but well perharps we just want to prevent other italian clubs from buying them and at the same time improve our squad. melo is great, though his mistakes has been costly. amauri return to form jsut before the break and prove to us (albeit against atlanta) why he should stay. we can ship them out, but who will pay that price for them? and since we are not gaining anything from the sale, we should give them more chance.

but i agree we may need to offload 1 target man striker, if we want to play ADP/giovinco/Diego/Camo as second striker, the question is who? trez is back before that injury, amauri could be awesome, iaq miss too much chances, but some of his finish is top draw. the best solution is to keep all of them (injuries, etc) and buy 1 left back (De Ceglie staying?) and maybe 1 midfield (any primavera ?)

just my 2 cents
papai

Marchisio is an auotmatic starter - there is no denying that.
Question is - does he pair up with Momo/Melo as DM,
or play instead of Gio in the 4-2-3-1?
In a 4-3-1-2, it is a simple choice of Camo - Melo - Marchisio, but the 4-2-3-1 is tricky.

My personal opinion is that we need the defensive screen of Momo + Melo infront of our defence. So even though I dont like it, i will play Marchisio instead of Gio.
Squeeze

Hello everyone, I just discovered your blog and I'm delighted to see how many Juve supporters there are in the world. :) For me Felipe Melo is a great player, but he HAS to throw the ball AWAY sometimes. He is playing since too long, he is always "titolare" and he played Confederation Cup too. I think he needs a rest, Sunday he did very bad.
Marchisio is surely the best italian young midfielder: tackling, passing, scoring, tactical cleverness. Amauri should get a lot of crosses from the side, but Molinaro and Grygera have really poor feet. Some better cross with Grosso and Caceres. Anyway, we paid Amauri 9 million cash PLUS Nocerino and Lanzafame (both hypervalued), so he was the only opportunity to buy without spending too much.

What a POOOOOOOOOOOOOOR inter! lol

My Juventus blog is in Italian, if you care.
www.visionibianconero.splinder...
Rinaldo

"We also sold a very good player for super cheap(marchionni). Whoever said we had a fantastic summer transfer policy was full of it. It’s like who is this salzmahic dude WTF. Also immobile?"

I would have to disagree with this part of your comment (unless I misunderstood your sarcasm). Marchionni really was garbage, and needed to be sold. That we sold him for peanuts is not too much of an issue - unless Melo really flops. Overall, if Melo can live up to his potential, this was a good transfer.

Salihamidzic is a very useful squad player for us. When not injured, he has featured at LB, RB, and RM. I'd prefer him over De Ceglie and Molinaro at LB, and would make a good sub for Camo at RM. Brazzo was a very clever acquisition.

Immobile? I don't understand your problem with our Primavera striker. Looks promising so far. Expect him to be loaned out in the summer.
Rinaldo

Melo is a beast. Give him time, he'll own this midfield.

Marchisio is a stud. The only true "complete midfielder" in our squad. Born and brought up in Turin, and part of the Juve squad since before he reached his teens - this is what football should be about. Our future captain (Del Piero -> Buffon -> Chiellini -> Marchisio. You read it here first ;) ).

Sissoko and Poulsen are curious cases. One has zero ball control and passing skills, but is the best tackler and ball winner in midfield; the other blows hot and cold - anonymous one day, and delivering Pirlo-esque passes on others.

Tiago is deadwood and should be sold. Good player, but not needed. Unnecessary waste of a salary.

Camoranesi = awesomeness.

Marrone = potentially, a future Marchisio. Should be loaned out.

That's my review for our midfield.
Anthony

Sam, Juve's defense is nothing to be scoffed at. It's true that Buffon bailed us out a few times in the Champions League though.

Marchisio can absolutely play as a DM in a 4-2-3-1, but it just won't be playing to some of his strengths. It would limit his amount of forward runs which is one of his best strengths. I think he plays best in a 4-3-1-2, but he play well in a 4-2-3-1 as well.

And for those saying Melo hasn't played well, he has. Against Udinese though he was poor. That much was very obvious. But as soon as he settles in the team I think he'll be fine. Most of his performances have been solid, and a few have been excellent. True there have been some howlers earlier in the season, but other than that he's been very good. It's not a DM's job to score goals by the way lol. The fact that he has two is good lol.
Sam

Did you know?
Juventus have the meanest defence in the UEFA Champions League, having leaked just one goal in 360 minutes to date.

Pretty surprising eyy
Oliviero

just as a clarification for some Marchisio isn't starting because he is injured and i do think when he regains match fitness he will still have a starting spot simply because hes the most complete midfielder we have.
Jose

Gaetano, in response to your comment about Gio, Immobile and Marchisio. I think Marchisio should be given a starting spot, he is the best MF we have. Gio should be given time to grow, at least one or two seasons more, if that doesn't work, we have a certain Fausto Rossi that will sit on the left attacking midfield very nicely (better than De Ceglie I think). Last Immobile should be given more time to play, he seems like a beast.
Jose

Here are my two cents on Melo. I didn't watch Juve when they got Nedved, but my understanding is that it took time for him to settle, we all know how that worked out for us (if I am a Juve fan, I think is because of Nedved). I will be the first one to say that against Udinense Melo played horrible and his mistakes have been costly so far, but same can be said about other players.

For all the people that are praising Sissoko, I still remember when we kicked a Fiorentina player (I think it was Gilardino), in the area in the last minute to allow the Viola to either tie or win the game against Juve. I wanted that guy fired, his contract burned and I wanted Secco to explain to us why he bought Sissoko on the first place. Now, after a year and a half, Sissoko is a solid midfielder, who can't pass for the life of him but has good work rate. We have learned that we need to give him easy options to make a pass that is not further than 2 meters and he will be fine.

So, as for Melo, lets give him time, he might have had a bad game (like any other soccer player), give him the chance to grow and allow him to meet his team. He has played with Sissoko, Tiago, Marchisio and Poulsen, in two different formations. Oliviero, IMO he played very well not only against Roma, but against Sampdoria and also against Atalanta. I know that 3 games are not good enough for 23 million but let him settle, maybe he will be a legend like Nedved was.
Gaetano

Good point oliviero. I did not say that melo has dazzled me nor was I defending him. I feel the same about amauri. Melo I think has scored twice and that seems like a little for 23 million but I think he is getting a lot if heat from the press which is not good for his confidence. Marchisio had been much better and should get a start. The real problem with our team is that it's still building and at times seems schizophrenic. We held on to too many shit players and didn't t buy what we absolutely needed. We also sold a very good player for super cheap(marchionni). Whoever said we had a fantastic summer transfer policy was full of it. It's like who is this salzmahic dude WTF. Also immobile? Gio and marchisio cannot sit the bench nor can they wait for someone to get injured. As far as melo goes he should start but needs to prove his worth immediately-- like tomorrow with a goal.
Oliviero

well first off i think the game today proved that inter is not even in the same league as barcelona although i think that was evident before hand...
In response to Gaetano how much money we pay for someone does not guarantee them a starting position and when i think that we bought him for 23 million i think of all the other players we could have gotten instead.
In response to everyone else who is defending melo i really don't see all of these brilliant performances people are talking about. He had one good game against Roma but otherwise every time i see him get the ball anywhere near our goal i cringe. Granted Sissoko is prone to making some easy mistakes as well but he has so much more potential as a player that spending 23 million on him was terrible.
As for playing with marchisio in the 2 i think my main point in putting him their would be to support sissoko and give him a short pass option.
well thats a long post but i think i addressed everything :)
georg

my congrats to fiorentine, very nice. thats 1 english team out :)
lets hope juventus en milan quallify tommorow
takeover in power by italy??
Sam Dj

glad to see inter down 2-0
Gaetano

What if we interchange camo with del piero and marchisio with gio keeping the
4231 system with melo and sissoko. Let poulson fight for his spot too. When diego needs rest we should switch to a 442. I m also concerned about what will happen when iaquinta is fit because I think his role is better when playing with another striker. Can t see him operating as the lone striker. He likes the ball rolling just in front of him with space.

In my humble opinion we should sell amauri. We need to pick up a quality stiker who consistently finds the back of the net and who will eventually replace trez. I can t bare to watch him flailing and complaining all the time. Another luca toni. The fact that he is getting a look for the la nazionale is mind boggling to me. I also I think(like most of u) we should sell or trade molinaro and zebina for
Gaetano

Oliveiro your formation does t include melo.. We paid 23 million for him this summmer and he ian t an automatic starter???
Pablo

No.
Gaetano

Should we sell amauri?
agiamba

Cannavaro- "I have been going to football grounds for years and I hear all kinds of things being said."

Haha, I bet he has. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...
dave

big piece....
j

we had just been fined...
alex

after his performances how can any of you say marchisio doesnt deserve a starting spot???? hes quite literally 10 times better than sissoko and melo! he runs the midfield when he plays his tackling is better than either of them! not to mention the fact hes fom torino i mean you have a potential world class local italian midfielder but there are some of you who prefer a overrated brazilian??

by the way melo is absolutely shit for the price you payed
ned lowe

the bar is set very high for amauri bcuz of how much he cost(tho it was a player plus $$$ deal)and because he's brazilian.
he did fairly well when he joined us...considering injuries to trezeguet n iaquinta,his arrival was timely and he formed a good partnership with del piero...

but since he returned from injury,he has'nt just looked the part...he grumbles too much and none of his pedladas n sombreros seem to work

IMHO opinion a fully-fit trezeguet is our no. 1 striker...iaquinta is a very decent sub n amauri has a shitload(pardon my french!) of expectation to live up to
Anthony

Mo, I would try that formation. But Gio wouldn't be the one defending the left flank. We need someone more defensive there. It would likely have to be Marchisio or De Ceglie. Or Grosso would have to play in a LM position. Otherwise if we play against a team with a good right winger we'll be in trouble.
Mo

I know Ferrara will always play with 4 deffenders but why not try a 3-5-2 system which is the system that capitalizes our strengths? Buffon-chiellini-legro-canna-sissoko-melo-Diego -camo-gio-dp and trez. It's pretty balanced but i guess Ferrara won't try another formation if we can't seem to master one! Let me know what u think?
Anthony

Papai, Marchisio can play in the wide left role too...but I'd really only play him there in place of Giovinco against really physical teams. When Giovinco is on form his creativity is very influential.

De Ceglie would feel more at home in a LM position than Marchisio would too.
Anthony

Oliviero, Melo had an uncharacteristically poor game. He is usually much better than that. Sissoko did have a very good game as well, but usually between the two I would start Melo.

I also think Marchisio is better suited to the 4-3-1-2, but he can do well in the 4-2-3-1 as well I think. Gio would probably have to come back and help out more in defense though I think because Marchisio isn't really a natural DM.
papai

Give Melo a break. Him and Diego has been really committed to our cause this season. Just one bad match and people start dissing a guy who has been more than impressive since joining us, lest we forget, less than six months ago. Our ideal defensive pairing needs to be Melo/Momo infront of the back 4. Marchisio should start further up, along with Diego and Camo, at the cost of Giovinco - i know this sounds hard, but we can always sub either of Momo/Melo, push Marchisio back and introduce Gio if we need more attacking options.
As for the striker, I will take Iaq over Amauri just for the workrate. But a fit Trez is always a starter for me.
Rinaldo

"Then i think our ideal team would be
buffon, caceres, chiellini, cannavaro, grosso, sissoko, marchisio, giovinco, diego, camoranesi, amauri/trez/iaquinta… Any ideas?"

I hope we can play that, Oliviero. Marchisio, imo, is our best central midfielder, but I don't know how he'll fare in a 4-2-3-1 where his main role would be that of a defensive midfielder. Playing him in a 4-2-3-1 might expose our fragile defense a bit. I hope I'm wrong, because I would love for us to play a 4-2-3-1 with Marchisio as one of the '2'.
agiamba

Offtopic- You know how shitty mcshitshit Julio Cruz has an annoying habit of scoring on us a lot? I realize we have our own Julio Cruz...Marcelo Zalayeta. At Napoli, he scored 2 goals in 3 games against Inter, in those 2 seasons he scored 12 goals total, and then at Bologna he just scored against them again, so 3 goals in 4 games. He's scored 2 at Bologna, so over the last 3 years or so, 22% of his goals have been against Inter. Not bad.
agiamba

Mmmm...I disagree. I haven't watched Chelsea but I hear Ancelotti is doing good things there. As for Inter, they are domestically pretty good (though not brilliant) but come on, their CL play? Awful.
Marco

i was having an intelligent conversation with my mate drinking some beers - we debated over the form of all the teams: My conclusions were met with some distaste here are my thoughts
1st tier teams - all interchangebale but non can argue i think.

imo

Barcelona
Chelsea
Inter

2nd Tier

Man U
Juve
Real Madrid
Arsenal
Ac Milan

Third Tier

Leverkusen
Bordeaux
Galatasary
Liverpool
Man City
Tottenham Hotspur

etc etc
Ivo

I agree with you Alessio, 4-2-3-1 with ADP and Diego will be tough to pull off.

4-3-1-2 seems like the way to go, but who would play on the left of the trident? Ideally I would put Marchisio there, maybe Giovinco if he can adjust to a deeper position than the one he has now. How awesome would it be to have Nedved there? Oh man.

Ale, and the rest of you for that matter, what is your ideal set-up of this team? We actually have plenty of options when healthy. Here is mine:

Buffon-Caceres, Canna, Chiellini, Grosso-Melo-Camoranese, Marchisio-Diego-ADP, Trezeguet.

I imagine them in a diamond with Melo as DM, Diego as AM, and ADP as second striker (deep-lying forward). Kind of like an adjusted 4-3-1-2 for a DM.
Oliviero

Some interesting things I picked up while watching La Domenica Sportiva last night... First I think every single person said that Diego and Del Piero cannot play together in a 4-2-3-1, Second everyone said that Melo was terrible and that when Sissoko came on he had numbers that were twice as good in half the playing time(tackles, balls recovered, passes completed). Another thing they mentioned but did not really delve into was that is it possible to play sissoko and poulsen together in front of the defense? Actually what I would like to see is if we could play Sissoko next to Marchisio in that defensive midfield pairing. Then i think our ideal team would be
buffon, caceres, chiellini, cannavaro, grosso, sissoko, marchisio, giovinco, diego, camoranesi, amauri/trez/iaquinta... Any ideas?
Pablo

I wish I could also write a long comment, but my finger are all numb for working with rain the whole day. But...

I agree with Rinaldo's point 2 and 4. Not so much with 1 (For me it is: Amauri, Trez, Iaq, but very very close) and not at all with 3 (Gio might be a good trequartista, just not yet).

Ivo: I also agree with DIego being better so far (but both have been good). It's hard to be stelar and consistent, specially when you are under 25 and playing a new system or team. Let's give both of them some time.

I think the main problem with Gio's game right now is when he is marked by 2 or more bog defenders. He should play more first touches.

That's all folks.
Nnahoj

I agree with Ivo that Diego has been better than Giovinco this season. Then again, Diego has had more playing time.

And I also agree Giovinco is super adorable and that alone warrants playing time.

Giovinco's problem seems to be the pressure put on his tiny, adorable shoulders. You can see him trying really hard to stand out rather than just play a good game. And when he does that - like yesterday - he ends up making mistakes (because he'll try to dribble rather than pass, or try to make a difficult pass rather than a simple one etc.) and then he looks bad and further jeopardizes his playing time. I think that's our fault really. We've (and by "we" I mean Juventus the club, fans and wider media) hyped him so much that he feels like he has to deliver or else. I read an article a while back about Italy's perceived hesitant attitude towards young players and how that could actually be a good thing (written by my friend Rainier Plahar, I suggest you read as well: http://www.insidefutbol.com/20... ) and I think what's going on with Giovinco is a perfect example. Marchisio has been allowed to grow as he wasn't being talked up as much as Gio, and De Ceglie if given the same chances then I am sure he would also have succeeded. But ever since he debut in Serie B and made that sweet assist for Trez, Gio's name has been on everyone's lips. I think at the end of the day, Gio could still be a great footballer - whether at Juve, now that's a different story - but for that to happen, at least for the time being, the expectations need to be lowered a bit.
Francesco

Amen to your last paragraph alessio. I say it all the time, I'd rather watch any Serie B game than the EPL.
agiamba

Also "pezzo grosso" for those jabronis out there kind of means like "the big cheese" I guess would be the closest translation. A nice little pun I thought.